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Quellen: gebrochene Schwerter (heute und historisch)

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Quellen: gebrochene Schwerter (heute und historisch)

Beitragvon jpk » Freitag 18. November 2011, 14:12

Eine Sammlung von zerstörten Schwertern aus Bildquellen und tatsächlichen modernen Unfällen mit den Klingen.

Genève, Bibliothèque de Genève, Ms. fr. 64, 30v
Collection:Swiss Medieval ManuscriptsManuscript Identifier:Ms. fr. 64Manuscript Title:Jean Mansel, La fleur des histoiresOrigin Date:Vers 1480
Genève, Bibliothèque de Genève, Ms. fr. 64, 30v.jpg

Man beachte auch hier die abgetrennten Hände. Diesmal bei Einhandwaffen.
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Re: Quellen: gebrochene Schwerter (heute und historisch)

Beitragvon jpk » Freitag 18. November 2011, 15:25

Chronicon Helvetiae Theil 1, Ms.WettF.16.1 - 1574.
Ms-WettF-16-1-07.jpg
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Re: Quellen: gebrochene Schwerter (heute und historisch)

Beitragvon jpk » Freitag 18. November 2011, 17:30

Swordfish 2010 injury report
by Roger N on Thu Nov 25, 2010 7:11 am
http://hemaalliance.com/discussion/view ... t=20#p7355
I have now received a report from the Swedish incidents. Turns out two broke for the same guy. The first broke when practicing zornort against oberhau with two Hanwei feders. The second broke while thrusting at a stationary target from Ochs. The blade flexed well, but snapped the first time it was used.

Broken_federschwert3.jpg

Here are two more images of the broken Swedish Hanwei feder. Axel also told me that as far as he knows, the Polish fencers have not used these, so I probably confused the Slovakians and the Polish.

Shows a bit of the quality of the steel. The pointy bit is the blade with the cross. Where the blade commonly breaks it is only about 1-2mm thick.

broken1.jpg

broken2.jpg


These two, along with a reported incident in the US and a whole bunch broken in Poland is a clear warning against using them in hard sparring.

During the International Open Championships of 2009, three Gen 1 broke in the competition and one was damaged enought that they didn't dare continue using it.

Also, during the 1st International Hammaborg Seminar, another Gen 1 broke, similarly to the Gen 2 shown here.

A point that has been raised though, is that sports fencing blades are designed to snap this way, as a safety feature. Seems odd to me though. Especially since the Hammaborg fencers didn't notice the breakage, but were alerted by the spectators.

A recent review (Sep 16) by Gesellschaft Lichtenawers mentions 3 out 4 swords broken within 15 light sparring fights. Again, the point is broken. These are the Gen 2s.

http://www.wmacoalition.com/forum/viewt ... 73&start=0

http://forums.swordforum.com/showthread ... 111&page=2

http://gesellschaft-lichtenawers.eu/tsc ... enzia.html


Re: Swordfish 2010 injury report
by ShaunnM.W. on Wed Dec 01, 2010 2:24 pm
The break that we had occur was in the same area, towards the tip, (I would say it was within a half inch of this one at the most) and it looked almost identical, same straight break with a slight curve like that one. The feder broke during a cut that was blocked and both of us knew something was wrong right away, even though we didn't know what exactly it was. I blocked the cut, barely felt any contact at all, and he swing just kept going right past me. The guy said he knew something was wrong for the same reason. It was the owner of the sword who was watching that actually saw the end of the sword go spinning off into the grass. It made me a little nervous, but I still feel very safe sparring with these blade, at least with my group all of whom I am comfortable sparring with. It is our hypothesis that it was an imperfection in teh grain, or it was caused by the heat treatment.
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Re: [Simulator] Empfehlenswerte Fechtfeder

Beitragvon jpk » Montag 3. Dezember 2012, 21:28

Von einem Ensifer Schulfederschwert gibt es inzwischen auch einen Bruch zu vermelden. Das Material ist halt nicht unermesslich haltbar.

Bild

Martin Fabian: the blade broke almost exactly in the last third. I got a very strong hit with a zwerch into my zwerch counter (under his blade). I was unfortunate to receive the hit edge to edge and it was literally torn off. I'll support a photo later. VERY unfortunate, this was my favorite sword, it was 1,5ys old
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Re: [Simulator] Empfehlenswerte Fechtfeder

Beitragvon jpk » Dienstag 29. Oktober 2013, 14:13

Bruch einer Regenyei Feder Okt 2013. Wie die Feder gebrochen ist, ist nicht bekannt. Vermutlich in einem Hieb.
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1396858_542797939136645_1287362840_o.jpg
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Re: Quellen: gebrochene Schwerter (heute und historisch)

Beitragvon jpk » Dienstag 29. Oktober 2013, 14:18

Broke a Meyer!
« on: 2012-06-12, 21:40:58 »

So our combat demos went pretty well this past weekend at VARF, but we did have one casualty. My Albion Meyer snapped when I was straightening the blade. I knew it would happen eventually, I was just hoping it would be a while.


broken_albion_meyer.jpg


Weitere Aussagen dazu:
by KeithFarrell » 10 Jul 2012 12:37
Apparently another Meyer has bitten the dust over on the Renfaire circuit in the States. This will bring the total up to 3 such breaks of which I am aware: Fabrice in 2009, Anders in 2011, and this fellow in 2012.


by Krist » 11 Jul 2012 16:48

The experience with the Albion swords is a little negative in our club. We had 9 blades amongst our members, 2 Liechtenauers and 7 Meyers.

5 of them broke (1 Liechtenauer and 4 Meyers). On all 5 of them the tip broke off during sparringsessions.

2 Meyers are still used in our weekly training- and sparringssessions. One is at the point where it sometimes bends but doesn't flex back into shape
As I'm afraid to destroy my Liechtenauer, I never use it for contact training, which is a shame

3 of the blades got replaced by Albion without any costs, but the owners had to wait 5-6 months. The other 2 are still waiting for a replacement.

In my opinion, they are great blades to handle, but they have serious quality problems. The fact that they get replaced free is great but it takes way to long.

We have blades from other manufacturers who are still going strong, after intens use. And all of the blades were cheaper

Greats
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Re: Quellen: gebrochene Schwerter (heute und historisch)

Beitragvon jpk » Dienstag 29. Oktober 2013, 14:27

Dass dieses Hanwei nach 8 Jahren bricht, ist verständlich. Doch sind diese Schwerter auch schon schneller gebrochen.
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Re: Quellen: gebrochene Schwerter (heute und historisch)

Beitragvon jpk » Dienstag 29. Oktober 2013, 14:41

Mit Gewalt geht alles kaputt - vor spulen zu 1:13
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z6Tn0riF ... lpage#t=73

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Re: Quellen: gebrochene Schwerter (heute und historisch)

Beitragvon jpk » Dienstag 29. Oktober 2013, 14:50

Rapiere brechen öfter



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3SauJDs6 ... page#t=158
Zeit 2:38
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Re: Quellen: gebrochene Schwerter (heute und historisch)

Beitragvon Richard Cole » Mittwoch 30. Oktober 2013, 15:06

Man kann es generell auf Blatt- oder Angelbruch reduzieren - wenn man Ausbrüche, die nicht zum kompletten Bruch des Blatts führen, außen vor lässt.

Fechtergruß
„Es gibt stets zwei Endpunkte, zwei Gegensätze. Die Kampfkunst ist die Fertigkeit, welche in ihre Mitte fällt.“
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